Dont know who the nuts are that Church Security referred to, but Jerald Tanner probably expressed the most legitimate concerns. Every metric you can imagine points to the same conclusion: from Paul VI forward, Catholicism has gone into deep crisis. Azerbaijan's Jabrayil Hasanov in action against The USA's Brent Metcalf. I dont agree with all the conclusions of your research but the research is a gift to all of us. Oh, that would be great! Brent, Did any of these projects or research ever prove anything? Im was left kind of hot but dry after hoping to hear about his drama with the church and its leaders.any chance of allowing closure for me here? I've debated whether or not I should write about this, as I'm well aware the reception may be inflammatory, however it's something I'd like to get off my chest. Indeed, the trivial matters that many theists assert as claiming the attention of God (even as hell is meanwhilebreaking loose) is absurd evidently too absurd for many to even grasp. Ack! This one is up there with the best. the tall man aboriginal spirit; metadata api request failed: component conversion failed: file_ended; caleb foote sandlot Why didnt the Lord reveal to the the prophet that Hofmann was going to kill? Nicely done, John. Brent Metcalf of the USA defeats Franklin Maren of Cuba to win Gold in the Men's 65kg Freestyle Final during the Toronto 2015 Pan Am Games at the. Read More: Where is Terri Christensen Now? I thought Brents response to this question very touching and informative and dont see that his research should be discredited. Lynn Jacobs was looked at carefully, I believe Brent Metcalf was looked at somewhat. In secret, behind closed doors, who were they really betting on? Brent did a marvelous job of creating a context by which these events took place. Boy, what a chilling conclusion. Two more parts (3 & 4) to come. In another post Ill comment on the Mark Hoffman affair. She also noted that after JS none of the preceding Church leaders really got what he was trying to do/teach in this realm. The LDS Church fired Brigham Young University professor David Wright for his contribution to the volume, and excommunicated both Wright and Metcalfe shortly thereafter. Brent Metcalf's last collegiate wrestling match was a highly anticipated one. It was stillbecause it all drove from the incredibility of the whole thing. 2023 Cinemaholic Inc. All rights reserved. Do you have any idea what his views are now about the church, what he did, etc.? Were they watching us? A scene from John Dehlin's upcoming disciplinary council, probably. This is the part Im most interested in: how would he suggest young aspiring researchers go about gathering and parsing primary and secondary sources?. I was only 8 when Steve died, so I just remember his smiling face and that everyone, especially my parents, just loved him. She is professor emeritus of history at Read more None of this means that believing scholars and secular scholars have to treat each other poorly or that we cannot respect (even in the midst of serious disagreement) each others work. but he threw out the baby with the bath water as if the success of Christianity rode on the success of Joseph Smith.. Thank you for this interview. Cultural Context Preceding the Book of Mormon, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/493__Brent_Metcalfe_Part_1.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/494__Brent_Metcalfe_Part_2.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-497-BrentMetcalfePt3.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-498-BrentMetcalfePt4.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-499-BrentMetcalfePt5.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-499b-BrentMetcalfePt6.mp3, https://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/trackingconfessions1.htm, Signature Books Mormon News, October 1317. by | Jun 23, 2022 | replace flower bed with gravel | pickleball courts on staten island | Jun 23, 2022 | replace flower bed with gravel | pickleball courts on staten island Im not sure who made this comment, (I think that it was on another thread),But it went something like thisBased upon the bretherns actions regarding the Salamander letter, The LDS leadership thought that Mark Hofmann was telling the truth and that Joseph Smith was the fraud. Privacy Policy. I love the podcasts. I clearly remember the frustration in her voice. If you were to interview Mark Hofmann, what would your top questions be? And it leaves this distrust in LDS leaders hanging with the viewer. I still remember the demo you and your friends gave in the Rec Hall for Mutual. Awesome music, right? Anyone know what that is and where I can find out more? I could read fine in private but the social damage was done and anxiety overwhelmed me every time. I have that info direct from Mac himself. Sandra was criticized by some Mormon Stories listeners for not being as critical of Christianity as she was of Mormonism. I just wish that I could undo everything. Despite this, though, Brent found the courage to keep his head held high and began delving deep into the issues surrounding the Book of Mormon, a topic that he had been looking to examine since the early 1980s. When discussing some of the details surrounding the Book of Abraham, he mentioned the Tale of Onidas and Kitumen. I have never heard of that before and cannot find anything about it. John, you asked for information about any of the Christensens. He remains an enigma. [7] The LDS Church fired Brigham Young University professor David Wright for his contribution to the volume, and excommunicated both Wright and Metcalfe shortly thereafter. A special thanks to Brent for giving up so much of his time to do these episodes, especially some of them as he was feeling very much under the weather. Do you believe that your martial arts and mental training has contributed to your belief system and the independence from the crowd? I was hoping you would have spoken more about the Book of Mormon and Abraham. And I went through a very long phase of just wishing that I had never been born. This has to be one of my top 10 favorite Mormonstories podcasts. Wrestling for coach Roy Hall at Davison High School in Michigan, Metcalf finished as arguably the #1 overall recruit with a career record of 228-0 with . In Part 4, Brent examines some of the issues surrounding traditional approaches to the Book of Mormon. In Part 1, Brent talks about his early days in the Church and his time working for Church security. This is one that definately left me wanting more. This was very similar to my experience. Thanks Brent for sharing your story with usand to John for bringing it to us. Near the end of a presentation you gave for the ExMormon Foundation, you said something to the effect of: People ask me how Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, how he pulled it off, how it all came about. This theory is now well accepted in academia. I think that it speaks volumes about their powers of discernment and what they truly think about Joseph Smith. The Gift of the Mormon Faith Crisis Podcast. Brent is generally a giant in Mormon Studies, and is a great guy. In this fascinating conversation Brent details that while working for Church security he was working on scholarly endeavors that he hoped would help contribute to apologitic defenses of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Come to the dark side and tell your story. Do you think he will ever come completely clean? I have been thinking nonstop about that analogy, because it is so illustrative of the disorder. [9] Metcalfe and the police were afraid Metcalfe might be a future target he went into hiding. So, based on Krakauers shared experience, it sounds like the answer is no, Hofmann doesnt do interviews. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. The insight into the many corners of Mormonism important to us here was delicious. John Are you done interviewing faithful members or promoting faithful stories? But I have a question for Brent. They have shown time and time again that that is all that matters to them. Shortly after returning home and leaving the church he was very active in Sunstone and various things of that nature, but has since moved on with his life and seems very happy with a small family of his own running a small restaurant he and his older brother own together. In other words, if it is an intrinsic aspect of a tradition to make historical claims or assertions about the underlying nature of the world, the falsification of those claims essentially undermines the character of that tradition. According to Metcalfe, he was questioned by LDS Church authorities about his writing for the 7EP and Sunstone was "forced to resign" from his job in April 1983. It would have helped me a lot to know I was not alone. As a personal friend and research assistant for both Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, Brent Metcalfe watched the whole episode unfold right before his eyes. Lex, the recommendation by Andrew is a good resource. Metcalfe (ed. I shared this source with Mike Quinn when he was writing _Early Mormonism and the Magic World View_. [4], In 1993 Metcalfe organized a group of scholars to publish a series of essays that sought to apply techniques of higher criticism to the Book of Mormon. An anonymous source reported that Roy Doxey, then the director of church correlation, wanted to know about the papers Metcalfe was studying at the Church Historical Library, which were on Elias Smith and others. In Part 5, we explore the history surrounding Joseph Smith and the Book of Abraham(one of the primary scriptural texts for the LDS Church). Unintended consequences here we come! african american gastroenterologist near me; district 36 lofts; how to turn off scan text on iphone 12 Before Mark Hoffman was exposed as a forger, was there anything that made you wonder how he managed to make so many great finds? Brent provided a detailed account of the Mark Hoffman story with a perspective that we seldom hear. And great questions John. Hinckley never responded, but was shortly thereafter offered the job by Christensen, which Metcalfe felt was orchestrated by Hinckley. Definitely one of my top 10 favorite stories on here. Also, make sure your second recording matches the first. Brent is a fascinating interview for Mormon Stories for many reasons, including: He knew forger and bomber Mark Hofmann personally. Many years later in his interview with Dehlin, Brent Metcalfe tells of a conversation that he had with Mark E. Peterson where he plainly admits he was lying in his book. That was fascinating, thank you. Perhaps she remembers me, the useless home teacher. Who does he think the last bomb was meant for? So yes, Brent, please comment on this phenomenon. Again, Im not sure that you would disagree with any of this. going back ten+ years when we first interacted online (message boards), but this interview gave me many more insights. We Elders thought this was powerful truth, to compliment the claims of the Book of Mormon, to convince the Jew and Gentile. This negative sentiment is perhaps made up for by Hofmann's victims. St. Martins Press. Many of the writers did become illustrious personalities, exactly as you point out. Should have added one more minor thing. Well also talk about the recent history of BYUs Maxwell Institute and what he sees in its future and in the future of Mormon apologetics overall. Im with you on the music Charles!! Why are they so adamant about excommunicating someone who has a different opinion than they do? And you are an example. What advice does Brent have for aspiring Mormon historians? On acquiring a PhD, after a year of university, apart from a lack of finances, I quickly noticed that the degree factory isnt a reflection on ones intelligence. Charles, I dont think I threw the baby out with the bathwater since my examination of the Hebrew and Christian scriptures resulted in the same intellectual concerns that I had with LDS scriptural extensions. I also wanted to tell you how disturbed I became to my very core about the way you were treated during your working for the church Then the description of the events of day of the bombings, where the meeting was still set with the GA! And how was it working with Mr. Ritner? Jn Few people had more of a front-row seat than Brent Metcalfe to the goings-on surrounding Mark Hofmann, the Salamander Letter, and the tragic events of October 1985 what would be dubbed as the Mormon Murders.. In it, Metcalfe himself wrote an essay that was the first to advance the Mosiah priority theory, or that Joseph Smith began dictating the Book of Mormon from the Book of Mosiah. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. Why didnt the church just pay for their own documents? But Ashment, a fellow member of the church, said he was disgusted with those who publicly protested the church action at a rally for Murphy on Salt Lake City's Main Street plaza Sunday night. He could have never imagined the true extent of Marks crimes, though. On the latest episode of Mormon Book Reviews Steven Pynakker interviews one of the most important scholars of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe. Yeah for Signature Books, Matt Christensen, and the internet!!!!! Our interview continues tonight!!! The view of the Lamb on mount Sion gave me joy unspeakable and full of glory. brent metcalfe excommunicated. It seems to me that going with what you may think everyone around knows is right (even if it isnt) more easily allows for these kinds of experiences more than realizing there are differences of opinion and thought and then vying for spiritual confirmation. Examples would be projects at the Serpent Mounds in Ohio, linguists studying things like Native Americans singing in a language that seemed close to Hebrew,archaeological digs in latin America that were obviously BOM related, etc. The interview was superb and the insight into this extraordinary life was gifted. Let me clarify. John Dehlin Faces Excommunication. Menu. This is definitely a not-miss interview. It is those moments of intimacy that really help me connect to the humanity of the interviewee. If you were to write a book, what aspects of the Hofmann story would you focus on? Regardless of what one takes to be the truth of things, the evidence is not in favor of liberal religiosity as a recipe for church growth- those churches and communities which move away from their traditional truth claims tend to atrophy relatively speedily. (The audio starts in Part 1 around 1:23.55) I did a little research and found a digitized & searchable copy of Elias Smiths autobiography. The lengthy, five-part series covers Metcalfes childhood in Mormonism, his mission, his time []. In Part 6, we talk to Brent about his interactions and run-ins with prominent Mormon apologists like Daniel Peterson, Lou Midgley and others. Not because it marked the end of the University of Iowa's senior's prestigious and highly . For the listeners who are curious, a portion of the book describes a first vision, copied below: https://play.google.com/books/reader?printsec=frontcover&output=reader&id=XH0rAAAAYAAJ&pg=GBS.PA54, The Lamb once slain appeared to my understanding, and while viewing him, I felt such love to him as I never felt to anything earthly. Best wishes, Brent! Im glad you found some of my remarks useful and thanks for the kind comments. I am so grateful I stumbled across them along with D. Michael Quinns books wow now 20 years ago. It also struck me that Brent in some ways represents the inverse of Sandra Tanner. It seems like in the aftermath of the bombings, combined with his zeal to argue the history of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. If you ever get the chance to talk with Steve Christensens wife and/or Brent Metcalfe again, I would like to hear you explore this dichotomy with them as they are polar opposites. Or at least, Lets Take this Puppy Down.. Biography [ edit] As a prep wrestler, Metcalf went undefeated with a career record of 228-0, won four consecutive Michigan state titles, and earned six junior national titles. Brenten "Brent" Metcalfe joined NW3C after working in law enforcement for over 13 years. All he had to say publicly if there was really no truth in it, was its simply not true and leave it at that. what happens if i ignore a ccj; I like Steve Christensens view on excommunication. https://signaturebookslibrary.org/?p=24440. If youre familiar with image editing, straying from objectivity reminds me of having a color cast in a photo. As soon as we can!